Art & Artist - Human Creativity in the Age of AI

Devastating Folk Pop: Kat Lane on Authentic Artistry in the Digital Age

• Kyle Ariel Knowles • Season 1 • Episode 3

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In this episode of the Art and Artist Podcast, host Kyle Ariel Knowles interviews singer-songwriter Kat Lane, who discusses her unique blend of devastating folk pop, her musical influences, and the impact of social media, particularly TikTok, on her career. Kat shares her journey of songwriting, the importance of authenticity in her music, and her experiences with live performances. She also reflects on her early musical background, the role of collaboration in music production, and the meaning behind her song 'Just My Luck.' The conversation highlights the challenges and joys of being a musician in today's digital age.

TAKEAWAYS

  • Kat Lane's music is a blend of folk and pop influences.
  • TikTok has played a significant role in her music career.
  • Songwriting is a spiritual and creative process for Kat.
  • She values authenticity in her social media presence.
  • Collaboration is essential for music production.
  • Kat's early musical experiences shaped her current style.
  • She finds inspiration in live performances and community.
  • The importance of humility in the creative process.
  • Kat's song 'Just My Luck' critiques social media culture.
  • She aims to live creatively in all aspects of her life.


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Kyle Ariel Knowles: Hello there. Welcome to the Art and Artist Podcast. My name is Kyle Ariel Knowles and today's guest is Kat Lane. Kat is a singer, songwriter and multi instrumentalist from Boulder, Colorado. Her true passion is connecting with people through the power of music as a means of communication. She has been writing and performing devastating folk pop since she was a child with her music focusing on themes like nostalgia, communication, love and loss. Kat's debut EP, They Can't All Be Good, was self-released in August of 2022 and has garnered over 10,000 listens across streaming platforms. But Kat's true light shines when she performs live. Welcome to the show, Kat.

Kat Lane: Thank you, Kyle. I'm happy to be here.

Kyle Ariel Knowles: Yeah, I'm so excited for you to be on the show. So I guess my first question is, can you define what devastating folk pop is?

Kat Lane: Yeah, totally. I have a lot of like love and respect for folk music. Like I grew up in Colorado and there's like a strong like folk community and folk environment here. And then I also grew up like loving pop music and like catchy choruses and hooks. And I think it kind of just like naturally happened as I started playing more and more and started writing more that like I kind of had this like folk influence, but then I also had this like fun pop influence that like influences a lot of my like melody choices. So it tends to be kind of sad. I think a lot of my music is getting a little bit less sad as I've gotten older. So I don't know. But yeah, it's perhaps it's devastating sometimes.

Kyle Ariel Knowles: Okay. So name some artists that you grew up listening to that might have influenced some of your songwriting.

Kat Lane: Wow, I'm like, definitely, it's always funny when people say this, but like I am all over the map in terms of listening. My dad is really into music and I grew up listening to like a lot of Neil Young and Bob Dylan and like the band and Van Morrison and like some Grateful Dead too. It's just like kind of a like Colorado thing a little bit. And then. Like as I got older, I really got into like Gregory Allen Isikoff, who's like a local Boulder guy who, you know, has gained a lot of popularity. I love a band called Watch House, formerly Mandolin Orange. And then, yeah, these days, who am I listening to a lot right now? I'm, oh, I've been very into Lizzie McAlpine. I relate to her music a lot and I think we have similar writing styles.

Kyle Ariel Knowles: Well so she she has something that's on TikTok all the time, right, Failure, not failure to launch, but hard launch, right? Is that the same artist?

Kat Lane: I don't know, but she, so she definitely like had a song blow up on TikTok. And then that kind of like, she like used that to like platform her career. So, I mean, we can talk about TikTok, but like, yeah. it's like, you know, I never want to like refer to any artists as like a TikTok artist. they like, like Noah Khan is like another example of somebody who like blew up on TikTok, but like these are not TikTok artists. They're just artists and they are like using this tool to platform their music. So yeah, she's definitely popular on TikTok.

Kyle Ariel Knowles: Yeah, and I think I swear it's we'll have to look it up, but it's people are like putting something and writing some text and saying Hard Launch, you know, because they, I don't know, just broke up with someone or got a new job or whatever.

Kat Lane: Oh! I haven't seen it. Okay. I know I believe you

Kyle Ariel Knowles: Yeah, I mean, that's interesting because, you know, they blew up on TikTok or they're a TikTok artist or their an American idol, you know, Kelly Clarkson. She was an American idol, whatever, you know, I think you have to use any mediums you can to get your music out there. I'm sensing that you have a little bit of I don't know if it's negativity or trepidation with TikTok and being on TikTok. I know you've gone off it and gone back on and yeah, but you do have an audience there and people are saying like you just posted something 18 hours ago. I just saw a TikTok of yours where you're singing and someone is literally saying this. I needed this today. this person would have never heard you or known you as an artist if you were just doing traditional things or just putting your stuff out on Spotify or Apple or whatever. You know what mean? So and I I discovered you on TikTok. So this podcast wouldn't even be happening if you weren't on TikTok. And now you're in my on repeat on Spotify and I'm listening to your music there. do you know what I mean? So yeah, talk about TikTok and your like hesitation to be on there and going off and then coming back on.

Kat Lane: I have had like a pretty like challenging relationship with social media in general just like everyone else in the world but with TikTok specifically I think there are actually a lot of things I really like about it and something that I love about it is that like it's it's honest like the algorithm like is decided by what people like. So like when I'm posting on Instagram, which I do, it's to my friends and family and my friends and family, of course are like, my God, we love you. But something that I like about TikTok is that it's like, it's like, like ruthless and it's kind of brutally honest. And it's like something, something that I thought would like totally hit just like doesn't. And like some aspect of that is just like the luck of the draw or whatever. I have no idea how the algorithm works, but like. Another aspect of it is that it is like truth. It's like, okay, if people are liking it, then they're liking it. And they're not my friends. I don't know them. They're strangers. But it's also just, I mean, you're a musician, you're an artist as well. Like just self promotion in general is hard. And I think in 2025, like, you're not an. You're not just a musician. You're also you're manager, your you're Booker, you're your own agent. Like you're like you have to do everything you have to do all of your own marketing and like truth be told I'm just not very good at that stuff. So I am committed to posting and to getting music out there as much as possible But I think kind of the bargain that I've made with myself is that it has to feel honest like I am NOT gonna like thirst trap videos with trending sounds. I'm gonna just post like my music with my lyrics and I'm gonna and if that works great and that it feels honest and it feels fantastic but like if I was like blowing up for something that didn't feel authentic to myself I don't think that that leads to anywhere. fulfilling so my thing with tik-tok is like as long as I'm being like honest and true to myself with what I'm posting, great.

Kyle Ariel Knowles: Great. I don't know. I think there's so many people discovering music on TikTok.

Kat Lane: It's true, it's the place to be.

Kyle Ariel Knowles: Yeah, it's it's it's the place to be. And when I look at like, if I look at your YouTube, right? Like, many subscribers you have there or compared to Instagram and like, Instagram compared to TikTok, you have like three times the number of followers on TikTok, right? Or more three, three and a half times. So it's one of those things that if you keep posting, the algorithm rewards you and and and your authenticity and you know, this this whole idea that You know, your true light shines when you perform live. You even did a cover, I don't know how many months ago, I think when I first reached out to you, I think that was the first thing I saw was a cover you were doing of a song and you were playing piano and I was just like, amazing. It's amazing. And so thank you. And I hope you stay on TikTok and keep posting and things like that. But I understand how it's hard to be all things to everyone.

Kat Lane: Yeah, I'm, it's, TikTok is kind of like, It's almost like restored my hope in music a little bit for myself as well because it's like I play locally a lot in Colorado and I have like an awesome community of musical friends and I value that so much and it's so fulfilling to me to just like be out in the actual world playing music also but like I often ask myself like where is this going? Like why do I spend all this time writing these songs? Like And it's because I like love to write songs and I would be doing that whether anybody liked them or not. But having the ability to blast it out into the universe and just see what happens does feel a little bit magical to me, even though I like, you know, fundamentally despise social media. Generally, it does feel like, you know, there's possibility there. 

Kyle Ariel Knowles: It's like, it's so funny because a lot of people on TikTok are like, I want to be on TikTok and I want people to follow me, but not people that know me. You know, that's for the other socials. So, and I noticed, think comparing your Instagram versus TikTok, you're posting a lot more to TikTok, than Instagram.

Kat Lane: Yeah! Right it I actually think that's such an interesting concept too because it's like well Philosophically then you have kind of like this like fragmented self and occasionally I'll like Be on tik-tok. I try not to scroll that much. Like I really try not to like consume content that much on tik-tok, which is also like a You know ethical I don't know like it's like is it okay to produce a bunch of content but like disagree with consuming it who knows but I think I'll occasionally like see somebody from like high school or something pop up on my TikTok and I'm like, what the hell? Like, who is this? Like this is like a totally different person than the person that like I know in real life. And I think that's really interesting because it's like, well, in an ideal world for me, there wouldn't be like a...fragmentation. Like I would be comfortable posting anything I'm comfortable posting on TikTok to my Instagram or just saying in front of a room of people. Like I don't want to have like a hidden self on like some corner of the internet and like I think you know that's just part of like maturing as an artist as well where you're just like I have confidence in my abilities and I like the music that I'm writing so Shouldn't it be suitable for anybody to listen to? I don't know. Yeah, it's always like harder to play for people that you know than strangers, but it's an interesting thought for sure.

Kyle Ariel Knowles: Yeah, I love it. I love the conversation that we're having. So talk about how you even got into music making and singing and songwriting.

Kat Lane: Yeah, well, there's actually like a little bit of an error in my in my press kit, which I think is really funny, which cause like I like kind of wrote that but I used to have a manager and he wrote it and I have not been writing music since I was a kid. And I've been playing music since I was a kid. I grew up playing classical violin. And actually just this summer I like took my violin out again for the first time in like maybe like seven or eight years and took it to like the local Lutherie and like had them like fix a little sound post thing in it and like fix it up and I've been playing it and it's been like magical like I'm like how do I know how to do this and it's because I have this muscle memory from when I was a child but Yeah, when I was three years old, I was with my mom in a park and I heard these like teenagers playing violin. There was like a little like student violin thing happening. And I was like in tears. I was like, mom, like that I have to do that. Like that's the most important thing. Like I have to do that. She was like, you're three years old. You don't know what you're talking about. And then I didn't shut up about it for...Six months and so she put me in violin lessons and then I did that for like years and then when I got into high school I was like not really into the classical thing anymore and I just taught myself piano and I taught myself guitar and then I always loved to sing like singing was like I was always in choir and I just like loved it and I like it always it makes me feel good, but It wasn't until I was like 20 years old that I was like I should probably learn to like write lyrics like I don't know how to do that. And that whole process has been like really incredible for me because it's like learning to write lyrics is like, a spiritual process. It's like...I'm not sure, are you familiar with Rick Rubin? 

Kyle Ariel Knowles: Yeah. 

Kat Lane: I'm obsessed with Rick Rubin and like he talks about it as like these like creative ideas being on this kind of like cosmic conveyor belt and artists like reach up and grab them and bring them down and they're reflections of our like inner selves but they're also like seemingly coming from this like magical place and it took me like probably years. I mean, I'm still doing it, but like to actually sit down and write a song and be like, this isn't the most cringe thing anyone has ever heard. It took years for me to like actually like, like, like my stuff and like myself in that way. So I'm grateful for the process for sure. But then the other kind of piece of like creative inspiration that has been so instrumental in writing for me is Jeff Tweedy from Wilco, How to Write One Song. And it's just this like little book. and my mom gave it to me in a stocking for Christmas, like, I don't know, like six years ago, and I read it and it like set me free. Like I was like, oh my God, I don't have to judge myself. Like I can just create for the joy of creating and like what a delightful way to live my life. So I owe a lot to like other songwriters and other artists for kind of like shepherding the path, but. yeah, every year I get a little bit less judgmental and like enjoy making music a little bit more.

Kyle Ariel Knowles: Yeah, it's such a process. I want to check out that book for sure. 

Kate Lane: I highly recommend it.

Kyle Ariel Knowles: Yeah, and I know you've mentioned with your mom's library, Julia Cameron's on there.

Kat Lane: Oh, yeah, The Artist's way is also... Everyone should do it. Whether you're a creative person or not, you should do it. 

Kyle Ariel Knowles: She talks about how it's artist abuse. 

Kat Lane: It is. It's artist's abuse.

Kyle Ariel Knowles: To criticize these early works and you know, true artists will support other artists. 

Kat Lane: Every great songwriter wrote so many bad songs that you never heard. Like, it's not like they came out of the womb writing masterpieces. Like, you just got to like, get humble and get low and get in the dirt. And like, I think open mics are like the best outlet for this. Like, because it's like Okay, there might be like a room full of people who are just like not paying attention to you Like they're literally like like you're you're up there and you're like baring your soul with this new song that you wrote that might be really cringe and you don't know and everybody's just like drinking beer and not looking at you like You have to do those things. You have to humble yourself again and again and again to like refine the process

Kyle Ariel Knowles: And how do you keep going? I'm glad that TikTok is helping you, helping fuel that, like, oh, I'm going to keep doing this. What other ways do you keep going as an artist?

Kat Lane: Well, I'm glad that you brought up Julia Cameron because the morning pages thing is so critical. I've been a journaler since I was like 17. Like I have literally journals from like pretty much every week of my life for a decade for a decade. So that's like pretty cool to like be able to flip through and be like, my God, I was really dealing a lot with a lot that summer and like, but having a like in terms of how to keep going. One is that like you make it a day, like you make it a daily, you make it a way to live your life. Like instead of it's like this thing I do, I have this hobby. It's like, I mean, like I want to live creatively. Whether that's like building a garden in my backyard or writing songs or like making dinner. Like I want to like live in a creative way. So. that's kind of always in the back of my mind. And then I think the other way that you keep going, do you know Elizabeth Gilbert, the Eat Pray Love lady? 

Kyle Ariel Knowles: Yeah. Yeah.

Kat Lane: So she talked, I listened to a podcast of hers a while ago and she talks a lot about writing and she talks about like purpose, like young people like having this like purpose anxiety. And she talks about like there's a career, a job, a hobby, and a calling. And not everybody has a calling. And I think musicians and creative people have callings. And the definition of that is like, you're gonna do it, whether you're getting paid for it, whether people like it or not, because it feeds your soul. And that is how I've always felt about music, where it's like, it's this like special place that I get to go to and refuel for my life. Like that's where I like get like life energy to go do stuff and meet people. So there is kind of this like internal force that like kind of drives me to keep doing it. And then it's also like songwriting specifically is like, I need it. It helps me make sense of myself. It helps me make sense of heartbreak and like life stuff and so I'm grateful that it's what I've naturally gravitated towards because it has like helped me get through so much in my life.

Kyle Ariel Knowles: I love it. Yeah, I, I, we could talk for for days about all of this stuff, but I'm under some constraints here, so I want to get to just a couple more questions. Do you write mostly on guitar or piano or?

Kat Lane: I go back and forth and it's also, that's like a really helpful trick is that like, if I'm like writing mainly on, on guitar and I'm getting stuck, I'll just switch to piano. Like I'll just like, all right, like I know the chord progression here. I'm just going to do it on the piano and see if anything else comes up. And it often does because like sounds different. So I go through phases where I'm on both, but I tend to, it's like a, it's like a really easy way to like get out of writer's block, switching instruments for me.

Kyle Ariel Knowles: And is the violin helping you with like melody and stuff now? Are you coming up with like different melodies or what is it? What is it doing for your songwriting?

Kat Lane: It really, it's been so cool. I mean, mainly what I've been doing is I've been going to like these like old man bluegrass jams where that are like kind of up in the mountains in Colorado. it's like, like bluegrass musicians are really good musicians. Like they know the standards and they're like not messing around. And I've started bringing my violin to those and just like improvising a lot like you like you sit in a circle and then like somebody calls a song and then you like play in circles. So like the solo passes from one person to another and you do it for like hours. So I've been going to these bluegrass jams with my fiddle and just kind of experimenting and it definitely has been good for my songwriting in terms of like new melodies and yeah, for sure. 

Kyle Ariel Knowles: Just inspiration, really. I mean, it's funny because even just dialing up a sound, if you're using any kind of synthesizer or different sounds can also just be like, oh, there's a song right there. 

Kat Lane: Yeah. It's amazing.

Kyle Ariel Knowles: I want to talk about Just My Luck, because one of big reasons you're here on the podcast is your song, Just My Luck. And there's a lyric in it that says, maybe you should go back to school and start an MLM. Utah is the MLM capital of the world, so I was wondering if you have any ties to Utah.

Kat Lane: Okay, I don't have any ties to Utah, but I wrote that song in the Galapagos Islands, in like, like, in a very rural environment. And I used to guide these backpacking trips for 18 year olds, and I would be with them for like a semester long. And That one was in like Peru and Ecuador. So like I spent like six weeks in the Andes with them and then six weeks in the Amazon. It was like this incredible group of students. Some of them are really creatively inclined and we would like write music together at night like in the jungle. It was really cool. But I found when I'm traveling, which I've traveled a lot for work over the years, I always will go find a Church because churches always have pianos and I'll just like see if I can like slip into a back room in a church and like Play the piano so that whole recording was in a church in the Galapagos and you can kind of hear traffic in the background and you can hear like 

Kyle Ariel Knowles: Wow.

Kat Lane: Yeah, and we actually tried to track that we like tried to record that song like for real and We just like couldn't capture the feelings so we were like screw it make it the dead like put the demo on there But no, I don't have any ties to Utah but the MLM comment and like the coven thing too was like honestly kind of like a little bit of like a It's a little bit of a dig at like social media influencers who like aren't actually making anything I mean, some are and a lot have talent, but a lot of them are like making content, not art. And it's like for this like quick dopamine hit, it's to get people to buy stuff. And I'm like just not into that. So that was like a little bit of a stab at that, which I feel a little bad about, but no, no, no real ties to Utah other than that. like, I do love Utah.

Kyle Ariel Knowles: And I was wondering what the traffic noise was or you added that separately or whatever, but if you recorded it live and then right into an iPhone?

Kat Lane: Right into an iPhone and I do that a lot. iPhone is like for whatever reason iPhone really captures my voice well.

Kyle Ariel Knowles: And then what were you playing on? Cause it sounds like an electric piano or something. And is there a mod wheel on there or something?

Kat Lane: Yeah, it's a dinky little keyboard with a mod wheel and I just like happened to get a good take

Kyle Ariel Knowles: That's so cool. I love it. I know you're, you're singing and you're putting a bunch of music out on TikTok kind of, right? Are these new songs? 

Kat Lane: All new songs. 

Kyle Ariel Knowles: All new songs. And do you have plans to release another EP or some singles anytime?

Kat Lane: I would love to, I would absolutely love to, I have some constraints, just like all artists do when they're starting out, and it's that I don't know how to produce at all. And I really, I actually don't want to learn. I feel like learning, I actually tried to learn logic earlier this year. And it like was taking so much time away from actually playing music, because I was like, watching YouTube tutorials on how to learn logic. And I was Like you know what like there are so many people who are good at this who love to do it I should just find a really awesome collaborator who wants to produce my music and kind of understands the sound I'm going for so that's kind of one constraint so if anyone's listening to this and likes my music and wants to produce like kind of the experimental folk album hit me up and then also just like yeah time and people and money and but yes, I do intend I actually have, I have subtle plans to start recording again hopefully soon with a friend of mine in Salt Lake. 


Kyle Ariel Knowles: Cool. So will you play a song for us?

Kat Lane: Yeah, totally, I will. Okay, let me see what I got for you today. I've been playing... I've been playing like a lot of new stuff, but I wrote this song yesterday morning and I really like it and we'll see how it goes because it's not very practiced, but it's called I Only Ever Say Yes.

I only ever say yes to you 
You only do what you say you will do 
Live through the peace just to get to the fight
Why do I stand with my hands by my side?

I was a stone, skipped over rice 
You were like grass, growing towards light 
Split me in half and then pick a side 
We never knew how to do this right

The sky will fall like I knew it would
The glass begins to break
But I fall hard for performance art
I want it to make me shake

10 years ago, doing it right
No sense of failing, pride on my side
Nobody tells you how to do it right
I in my darkness, pay the price
And if I had known you way back then
You'd be a ???
I'd be a ???
Have I learned better what to feel
Or have I just suffered too long to care

The sky will fall like I knew it would
The glass begins to break
But I fall hard for performance art
I want it to make me shake
I want it to make me shake


Kyle Ariel Knowles: That was beautiful. Thank you so much for being on Art and Artist. I wish you so much peace and power as an artist, so you continue to create and share your art with the world.

Kat Lane: Aw, thank you for having me, Kyle. It was so good to talk to you.




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Kyle Ariel Knowles

Host
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Kat Lane

Guest